Spiritual Warfare

[Brigid]

What have you encountered that you are almost certain was spiritual warfare rather than a natural occurrence due to Original Sin?
I must admit, although a number of things I've seen seem to have been due to spiritual warfare, the natural was also a quite plausible explanation.

[Bailey2]

I cannot describe it but I can say that the natural/psychological and the spiritual was entwined like the threads of a rope and that it was very painful and yet enlightening at the same time.  I learned a lot.

[Brigid]

I cannot describe it but I can say that the natural/psychological and the spiritual was entwined like the threads of a rope and that it was very painful and yet enlightening at the same time.  I learned a lot.

Not trying to be nosy, but can you specify anymore (comfortably I mean)?

[Bailey2]

Brigid, I will try later....... not that I don't want to but it was a long time and it is so very hard to put to words.  Only a book would reflect the learnings thereof.

[Patricia]

Brigid, do you mean demonic attacks ?

[Brigid]

Brigid, do you mean demonic attacks ?

Yes, although not necessarily physical at all.

And Bailey2 - I really understand.

[Patricia]

I can't go into more details, except that there was a situation at home months back that wasn't good and my oldest began experiencing weird things. Heavy footsteps in her room after we were all in bed, tapping on the wall, tv turning on its own. It froze her in fear and I started praying the Rosary in her room, blessed it with holy water, St. Michael prayer etc , blessed the children with holy water. After that it would stop for a few days and then it would start again. And I would be in there with my weapons of grace One night i even slept with her to face whatever it was and nothing happened.
Then the family situation changed and she also stopped experiencing the diabolical whatever-it-was. Then again some months back, she began screaming that there was a sharp knocking on the door and I ran to her room and opened the door and she came slept with us. I blessed the room again . And after that incident Praise God and thank St. Michael and our guardian angels, things are back to normal. No trouble.

I think even I may have experienced some thing but not as severe as my girl. I heard a child run to the front door and i was sure my little girl was at the front door and when i went to scold her , there was no one. My girl was watching cartoons in the other room and said she hadn't moved. Some other things happened but I can't mention it here.

Now everything is fine. No problem at all.

[Brigid]

I can't go into more details, except that there was a situation at home months back that wasn't good and my oldest began experiencing weird things. Heavy footsteps in her room after we were all in bed, tapping on the wall, tv turning on its own. It froze her in fear and I started praying the Rosary in her room, blessed it with holy water, St. Michael prayer etc , blessed the children with holy water. After that it would stop for a few days and then it would start again. And I would be in there with my weapons of grace One night i even slept with her to face whatever it was and nothing happened.
Then the family situation changed and she also stopped experiencing the diabolical whatever-it-was. Then again some months back, she began screaming that there was a sharp knocking on the door and I ran to her room and opened the door and she came slept with us. I blessed the room again . And after that incident Praise God and thank St. Michael and our guardian angels, things are back to normal. No trouble.

I think even I may have experienced some thing but not as severe as my girl. I heard a child run to the front door and i was sure my little girl was at the front door and when i went to scold her , there was no one. My girl was watching cartoons in the other room and said she hadn't moved. Some other things happened but I can't mention it here.

Now everything is fine. No problem at all.

Sounds to me that at least a home blessing (hopefully with a home exorcism) might be called for. If only your daughter heard things I would wonder if there might be something psychological going on, but since you've experienced it, too and with the TV turning on by itself, etc. then well, .........  Maybe some Blessed salt might help, too?  What do the rest of you think about this?

My own experiences haven't been so clearly spiritual (they even caused me to wonder whether I sleep walk without remembering it), although I have had strange 'feelings' and automatically started saying the Rosary and the St. Michael Prayer while holding my scapular that has the MM and St. Benedict Medal on it. Nothing as straightforward as you two seem to have had.

[Patricia]

Sounds to me that at least a home blessing (hopefully with a home exorcism) might be called for. Undecided

That was on my mind, but now since the activity has stopped I don't see the need. Also had a bad dream some weeks back, and the strange part is I'm not sure if I was awake or if it was a dream, and I felt threatened by some force which scared me so much that I was immobilized. I tried to call out to my daughter but couldn't. I was frozen and all I could muster mentally was "St. Michael, St. Michael" and the force disappeared. It is strange and I wonder if it was just a bad dream . It could also be the psychological state we are in since the recent loss, but I don't rule out my above experience as spiritual warfare. Since I am now about the task of enrolling the children in RCIC was one reason that came to my mind.

[Shin]

Sounds to me that at least a home blessing (hopefully with a home exorcism) might be called for. Undecided

That was on my mind, but now since the activity has stopped I don't see the need. Also had a bad dream some weeks back, and the strange part is I'm not sure if I was awake or if it was a dream, and I felt threatened by some force which scared me so much that I was immobilized. I tried to call out to my daughter but couldn't. I was frozen and all I could muster mentally was "St. Michael, St. Michael" and the force disappeared. It is strange and I wonder if it was just a bad dream . It could also be the psychological state we are in since the recent loss, but I don't rule out my above experience as spiritual warfare. Since I am now about the task of enrolling the children in RCIC was one reason that came to my mind.

I've found that 'sleep paralysis' is very commonly accompanied by demonic attacks. So too these will often occur when a person is half asleep, trying to sleep, or just waking up.

The monster under the bed may in fact, really be there in the spiritual sense, being simply in fact a demon.

Demons like scaring people. Things that go bump in the night are in fact not always people's natural fears and imagination being overactive, but instead either a certain a spiritual awareness or at least influence by the spiritual of the emotions.

This tends to confirm my belief that this state of mind is particular vulnerable to the spiritual -- it is after all similar to the state of mind of people in a state of hypnosis, or a state of simple receptivity, such as from watching television, or, one placed into artificially through meditation techniques from foreign religions, such as mantra repetition.

If you have trouble before sleeping or waking, remember to say special prayers for protection, and to have the habit of praying in troublesome situation so that even if you are dreaming   you might do so.

I tend to rarely have 'nightmares' so of those I've had I have been able to tell at times which are from spiritual sources, and thankfully, when you turn to God while dreaming, in prayer or thought this is the answer to a 'nightmare'.

When things are bad, sleep with a blessed crucifix under the pillow.

Holy water.. the St. Benedict medal because of its exorcism blessing these are some of the most effective..  

The best holy water is blessed with the old Roman Ritual.

[Brigid]

Sounds to me that at least a home blessing (hopefully with a home exorcism) might be called for. Undecided

That was on my mind, but now since the activity has stopped I don't see the need. Also had a bad dream some weeks back, and the strange part is I'm not sure if I was awake or if it was a dream, and I felt threatened by some force which scared me so much that I was immobilized. I tried to call out to my daughter but couldn't. I was frozen and all I could muster mentally was "St. Michael, St. Michael" and the force disappeared. It is strange and I wonder if it was just a bad dream . It could also be the psychological state we are in since the recent loss, but I don't rule out my above experience as spiritual warfare. Since I am now about the task of enrolling the children in RCIC was one reason that came to my mind.

Personally speaking, if possible, I'd definitely still get it Blessed (with exorcism). It's certainly possible that your Holy Water, prayers, and the Sacraments have discouraged demons to leave, but from what I've heard by exorcists, infestations of buildings usually don't totally quit on their own. BTW, every few nights I sprinkle my pillow with Holy Water in order to discourage "intrusions" into my dreams. It seems to work - which reminds me, I haven't done it lately and my nightmares are increasing.

Shin, what do you know about the use of Blessed salt? One sees it infrequently these days. Also, I realized when I was reading your post that I had a nightmare quite recently (and hadn't sprinkled my pillow  ) where I woke screaming because a priest, who I didn't know, was chasing me. I've never had a priest or anyone chase me nor had I been reading about anything like that happening.

One more thing Shin (or anyone) - I've never heard it mentioned, but do you know whether it's worth it (for more than 10 minutes) to get an apartment Blessed. Since the walls and ceilings/floors are the same as another apartments, it would seem to me to be pointless.

[Patricia]

I'll certainly think of getting a priest over if there is one more incident.
Also I want to get a St. Benedict medal. Any ideas where to get one or I could just search the internet. Why is the St. Benedict medal considered so effective against evil spirits?
I have the Brown Scapular with the Miraculous medal on my person so i know I wont be hurt physically even if I'm threatened.
And as Brigid asked, what is blessed salt and how is it different from holy water?

[Brigid]

Bailey2 - your last post wasn't ignored. I was thinking of the best way to respond. I didn't want to frustrate you and wanted to explain what the other posters and I meant without shutting you out or writing a dissertation. I think I have an idea but have to put it together. I do understand what you're saying.

[Brigid]

Okay, Bailey2 - I think I may have found a way. (Tell me if it doesn't clear things up.)

Does the Church teach that we are to take Jesus' words in John 6:55-57 only symbolically (or allegorically)?  

Does the Church teach that we are to take Jesus' words in Matt. 16:18 only symbolically (or allegorically)?  

Remember, the Church teaches we are to take Scripture both allegorically and literally (not literistically!) - layer upon layer, like St. John's Gospel is a plain example of. Then what does it mean that Satan tempted Jesus in the desert? What does it mean that satan prowls around us like a lion? What does it mean that satan entered into Judas?

So, yes, your comments are a good synthesis of one way that Scripture can be read. There is additional way to look to look at it, that follows what Popes and the Fathers have understood.

[Bailey2]

Don't worry about shutting me out; I already know you are all very accepting.    Don't worry about frustrating me.  After Lent, I decided I have nothing to prove by trying to get points across here.  I'd be better off listening and learning and maybe sharing this and that.  

But, I think I put myself out there a bit too much in that post and as I told shin once, there are many viewing these forums who aren't contributing..........
And I figured no one could relate anyway.  So both those things.  Interesting that you say you do.

Anyway, I still think of spiritual warfare as the struggle with sin and I think demons are not ghost like; anymore than angels....... as portrayed in pictures.   There are probably scripture and tradition to support otherwise..... fire away if you know them.  



OK girl, you posted after I just finished this so I'll go back and look at all that....... but right now I just want to peek at the other threads and then join the boys here watching the Predators vs Chicago game.  Then, the Red Wings play tomorrow.  Boy this playoff thing is all consuming!  I read while I watch but I like to sit with them.  It's the only time we all can be together.  Teenagers, you know don't like to hang out with mom and dad!

 

[Brigid]

Yes, I do understand, even though I disagree with your over-simplification.

We aren't saying that demons present themselves as "ghostlike", however what/who do you think that St. Teresa of Avila was talking to when she woke being strangled by s.... and told him, "Oh, it's only you" before she turned over and went back to sleep? Do you feel it was her sins and and she said "you" only metaphorically? What of St. Padre Pio when he fought the d..... all night and had the scratch marks to prove it the next day? You think that he was mortifying himself for his sins (and had never mortified himself before)?

Yes, although we don't want to give him too much notice so as to give him power to influence us, that doesn't mean we don't acknowledge what Scripture has written of the enemy of God. He may not have red tights and funny horns , but that doesn't mean he doesn't exist as an entity to be avoided (and as St. Teresa of Avila did, scorned). You think that all exorcists "kooky"?

This is not to say that our sins are not related in a real way to this. The d...... takes advantage of our weaknesses due to concupiscence. It is not an either/or situation at all. Just not a single way of understanding Scripture. St. Gregory says of the word "angel" that this is a designation of office not of nature.

Take a look at John 14:30, John 12:31, and John 3:10,8. Or Colossians 1:16.