Tales from the Desert Fathers - God and Repentance

[Shin]

A brother was beset by the demon of lust. It so happened that the brother once passed by a village in Egypt and saw a beautiful woman, who was the daughter of a pagan priest. On seeing her, he was wildly aroused and, under the influence of his passions, went to the father of the girl and said:

"Give me your daughter as my wife."

"I cannot give her to you," the pagan priest answered, "without asking my god. Wait a bit."

Indeed, the pagan priest went to his god's oracle (through which, as we know, the Devil speaks) and asked:

"A monk came to my home and wants my daughter as his wife. Shall I give her to him?"

The demon hidden in the oracle answered him:

"Ask him if he will deny his God, his Baptism, and the vows which he made as a monk."

When the pagan priest returned, he said to the monk: "Will you deny your God, your Baptism, and your monastic vocation?" Indeed the monk accepted his terms. But immediately he saw something bright come from his mouth and, like a dove, go up to the heavens.

Right away the pagan priest ran to the demon and said: "Behold, the monk did all that you asked." Then the demon said to him:

"Do not give your daughter to him as a wife, for his God has not departed from him, but is still helping him." So once again the pagan priest went to the monk and told him:

"I cannot give you my daughter as a wife, since your God continues to remain near you and help you."

On hearing this response, the monk was deeply moved and said within himself: "Even though God in His singular goodness has bestowed upon me so many good things, I -- wretch that I am -- have denied Him, His holy Baptism, and my monastic vows. But despite my denial, God has not departed from me, though I have so greatly betrayed Him, and continues to help me. After that, do I not have a duty to run to Him, grounded in the surety of His boundless goodness?"

Having now recovered from the dizziness of passion, the brother immediately left for the desert and went to his Elder, to whom he confessed his denial, as well as all of his thoughts.

With kindness, the Elder told him:

"Brother, remain with me in my cave and fast two days at a time for three weeks: that is, you can fast strenuously for two days and on the third relax the fast. And I will ask God to forgive you."

The Elder did indeed grieve for the brother and entreated God with earnestness: "My God," he would say, "give me the soul of this monk and receive his repentance."

God, merciful as He is, heard the sincere and fervent prayer of the Elder, especially since it came forth from genuine love.

When the first week of the cloistered monk's penance had been fulfilled, the Elder visited him and told him:

"Have you perhaps beheld something?"

"Yes," the monk answered, "I saw a dove high in the heavens in front of my head."

The Elder said to the repentant monk:

"Take care for yourself and ask God with the whole of your soul, without cessation, to forgive you." With these recommendations the Elder once again departed.

As soon as the second week had passed, the Elder came again to the cave where the monk was cloistered:

"So, how is it going, Brother? Perhaps you have seen something?" he asked with fatherly concern and care.

"Yes, Elder. I saw a dove next to my head."

The Elder, having advised him anew to pray with earnestness and to stay in a state of vigilance in his soul, took leave.

When, at least, the third week had elapsed, the Elder went to the cloistered monk and said to him:

"Have you seen anything more?"

With joy, the monk answered:

"I saw the dove come and perch on my head. Then, when I stretched out my hand with joy to grab him, he flew into my mouth."

When the Elder heard this answer, he thanked God and said to the repentant monk: "Do you see, my brother? God has accepted your repentance. Therefore, be careful with yourself from now on."

Crying, the emotion-filled brother answered the Elder:

"From now on and ever after, Father, I will remain near you, and I shall not leave until I die." And, indeed, the monk remained with the Elder and never left.

- The Sayings of the Desert Fathers

[Shin]

This story from the desert fathers, follows a theme I have seen often that is of begging God's mercy and for acceptance of repentance repeatedly.

What is sin but to deny our Baptismal vows?

What has been on my mind lately is the difference between brief or temporary repentance and lasting repentance. I shall include another story in a moment about that.

And also thinking of this in the context of what we had come up earlier, about how the will to do a sin had we the opportunity, can be the same in God's eyes as the sin.

So, I am thinking of how to lastingly repent of sins it seems to me we need to think ahead to ourselves faced what tempts us, and deny it as if in the moment of temptation and so strengthen ourselves when the actual temptation comes. Preparing ourselves ahead of time, and changing our hearts to reject sin naturally both when it is attempting to tempt us and when we are simply sorrowed over it and repentant.

Because I think for repeat sins, we are often repentant after sin, but when the temptation comes upon us again, we overeat, we get angry, we fail again in one situation or another.

In other words, we have made an outward resolution, because of our emotions in repentance but inwardly, we have failed to follow through and change ourselves so that it is truly no longer a part of our lives. So that when tempted again, it returns to us.

So we have to prepare ahead of time and change ourselves interiorly so that we are finally resistant to sin whatever our emotional state. By this test, we make our repentance for all sorts of sins more lasting and true.

We have to picture two kinds of person, the before and the after, and what that person is like inside.. and become the new man by empathizing with him, how he feels, how he thinks, how he acts, this is what we have to become, and the old one we need to no longer empathize with in such a way that we are that person. 

Well, just thinking aloud a bit here, for what little it is worth.

[Shin]

The parents of a young girl by the name of Taisia died and left her an orphan. The young woman converted her home into a guest house for the Fathers of a neighboring skete. For many years she thus welcomed them and showed them care through her hospitality.

After some time, however, having spent all that she had in her hospitable work for the Fathers, she fell into need and became poor.

So it was that she fell in with some perverted people who led her to change her way of life and to abandon the path of virtue. The result of these destructive associations of hers was that Taisia flourished ever more in the way of sin, ending up, in time, in prostitution.

When the Fathers heard of her plight, it much saddened them.

So, they called upon Abba John the Short and said to him: "We have learned that our sister Taisia is living in sin. It is well known that, when she was still able, she showed us her love and hospitality and gave us rest. It is now time for us to help her as much as we can. Take upon yourself the task, then, of meeting with her and try, with the wisdom that God has given you, to set her aright and to pull her out of the mud of debauchery."

The Elder thus went to the den of sin where Taisia was staying.

"Inform your mistress, please, that I am asking for her," he told the old woman who was the doorkeeper of the house of ill repute.

"Get out of here, monk," the old women told him angrily. "You monks early on took all that she had and have left her poor now."

"Please go and do as I asked you," the Elder insisted, "because I aim to bring her great benefit."

The old woman finally stubbornly went upstairs and yelled to Taisia. that some monk wanted to visit her.

"Those monks," Taisia thought, on hearing who it was who was asking for her, "frequently live near the Red Sea and find valuable pearls."

Having adorned herself with special care, she lay down on her bed and said to the old woman porter:

"Bring the monk to me."

So, in fact, shortly Abba John entered the appointed room and sat near her. Looking carefully into her face, he said emotionally:

"What is it that you have against Jesus, and why do you blame him for coming to such a state as this?"

She, upon hearing these words, was totally paralyzed. At the same time, the Elder lowered his head and began to weep in sobs.

Shaken, Taisia then asked him:

"Abba, why are you crying?"

Abba John, raising his head a little, and then lowering it again, said:

"How can I see Satan playing on your face and not cry?"

At this remark, the sinful Taisia asked:

"Is there such a thing as repentance, Father?"

"Yes, there is," the Elder replied.

"Then take me with you," Taisia said, " and direct me as you will."

"So, let us go now."

At the beckoning of the Elder, the repentant sinner immediately arose to follow him.

The Elder was beset by astonishment, since he saw that Taisia had no interest in settling her household matters, but left things just as they were and followed him.

By the time they reached the desert, it had become completely dark. Abba John prepared a little place to sleep for her and, having made the sign of the Cross on it, told her:

"Sleep here." And after he had prepared for himself an improvised place to sleep on the ground, a short distance away, he completed his prayers and lay down to rest.

During the middle of the night he awakened and saw a strange spectacle; he saw a shining pathway leading heavenward from the spot where Taisia was sleeping and Angels of God leading the soul of the repentant sinner upwards along it.

Immediately he got up and, rushing toward Taisia, tapped her lightly with his foot. Once he realized that she was indeed dead, he prostrated with his face to the earth and entreated God to reveal to him whether He had accepted Taisia's repentance. Praying in this manner, he heard a voice from God, which said to him:

"The single hour for which this women repented was more quickly received than that of many who spend years in repentance, since the repentance of the latter is not as earnest as hers."

- Amphilochius

[martin]

Well, just thinking aloud a bit here, for what little it is worth.

Worth more than you know Shin... Keep thinking aloud. 

[Shin]

Well generally I see myself as very repentant and contrite often enough, and then later on taking chances that I should not and becoming more casual for one reason or another.

And so then, I see, facing myself as when I am casual and coming to grips with repentance when I am in that mood as key towards making lasting progress and repentance.

There was another story.. let me post it..

'There once lived a man named Chrysaorios, from among the most notable of this world. To the degree, however, that he added to his wealth, so much more he enriched his passions. Pumped up by vanity, he submitted without resistance to the passions of the flesh, endeavoring to amass many riches and inflamed by the passion of greed.

When, however, the Lord deigned to put an end to the many sins of this man, he allowed Chrysaorios to fall to a life-threatening illness.

Now, when he had come to the last moment of his life, and while his eyes were still wide open, he saw before him frightful and dark-faced spirits, who were there to help escort him to the gates of Hell. He began to tremble and turn pale and was drenched with perspiration; crying out in desperation, terrified, he pleaded for a little time (in order to repent).

He called with deep and agitated cries for his son Maximos, whom I later knew as a monk when I, too, was a monk, saying: "Maximos of mine, come to me. Never have I done you wrong. Save me now with the strength of your faith."

Thereupon, Maximos, upset and weeping, immediately went to him, along with all those who lived in Chrysaorios' house. Though none of them was able to see the evil spirits which had beset Chrysaorios, they could conclude that they were there from everything that the suffering man was saying and from his pallor and the fear which he showed, since he was turning here and there in his bed from fear of the vexatious spirits and their dark forms. One minute he would turn to the left, only to see in front of him those spirits which he dared not confront. Then he would look away toward the wall, only to see them again standing before him.

So, having despaired of any possibility of escaping from them, he began to cry out: "At least give me time until the morning—a little time until the morning." With these cries his soul departed from the body.

In all of this, it is obvious that Chrysaorios saw all of these things not for his own benefit, but for ours, that we might learn, come to fear, and correct our ways. For of what benefit to Chrysaorios was the appearance of evil spirits before his death or the reprieve which he sought, yet did not receive?'

'A similar instance was related to me by the Presbyter serving our brotherhood, Athanasios. In Iconium, from which he also hailed, there was a monastery: the monastery of the "Galatians," as it was called. In the monastery there lived a certain monk, whom all considered to have attained to a high degree of virtue and seemliness. As his death revealed, however, his life was far removed from the apparent virtues that he showed.

One day, foreseeing that his end was near, he called near him all the brothers of the monastery. The brothers gathered around him with great eagerness, waiting to hear from such a virtuous ascetic, as they reckoned him, something great and wondrous, now that he was dying. Thereupon, he, mourning and trembling from his fear, said:

"You thought that I was fasting with you, when in fact, hidden away from you, I was eating. And now behold: I am delivered to the frightful Dragon to be devoured. This frightful Dragon has wrapped his tail around my feet and my knees, putting my head in his mouth, while he sucks out and uproots my soul."

Having said this, he immediately died, without having been granted to live even a short time in order, through repentance, to be set free from that Dragon. From this incident it becomes wholly obvious that he saw this fearful vision solely for the spiritual benefit of those who were listening, since he, even though he made known to others the Enemy to whom he was delivered up, nonetheless could not escape it.'

Pope St. Gregory the Great

[Shin]

Now in the above stories you see these people 'do not have enough time' to repent..

Now we can think of various reasons as to why.. God's justice, etc.. but one possible factor that strikes me is incapacity of a self made kind, where truly, because of their so long bad motivations they are not going to be able to interiorly not wish to do what is wrong if the opportunity is there..

I was thinking of repentance in this light.. and weak repentance..

Asking the question: What is repentance, is it a thought, or is it in the will?

And that question seems to provide answers.

[Brigid]

that we might learn, come to fear, and correct our ways.

Learn to fear? But isn't learning to love the rather than fear our a most important lesson from the NT? After all, 'charity covers a multitude of sins'.

Asking the question: What is repentance, is it a thought, or is it in the will?

That is exactly what I was wondering. It must be both - since we are creatures that have both capacities. It seems to me that one without the other wouldn't be complete (although better than nothing, I suppose).

[Shin]

Well, love is more important than fear, but you can't do without either of them.

In my case fear has helped me to overcome a good deal, and continues to do so.

Without fear, people sin and try to coast on love to get them out of it, and that is not true love of God in any case. "I never knew ye," may well be the reply to such people.

I am thinking -- If you love something sinful, how can you break from it without the use of fear, or hate, or so forth?

I think there's the kind of fear the wicked especially should have, so that they repent, and then there's the kind of fear the saints especially have, of the consequences of sin in the light of their love of God.

But we have to begin at the beginning. 'The fear of God is the beginning of wisdom.'

'"That Thy beloved may be delivered." I wish to terrify them, says God, in order that struck by fear they may rise from the bed of sin and return to me. In their affliction they will rise early to Me. Yes, the Lord, although he sees us so ungrateful and worthy of punishment, is eager to free us from it, because however ungrateful we may be, he loves us and wishes us well. Give us help from trouble. Thus, in sum, prayed David; and thus ought we to pray. Grant, O Lord, that this scourge which now afflicts us may open our eyes, so that we depart from sin; because if we do not here abandon it, sin will lead us to eternal damnation, which is a scourge enduring forever.'

St. Alphonsus Maria de Liguori

'When the devil again tempts you to sin, telling you that God is merciful, remember that the Lord showeth mercy to them that fear Him, but not to them who despise Him.'

St. Alphonsus Maria de Liguori

'Ecclesiasticus says, that the fear of the Lord brings not pain, but joy and gladness: The fear of the Lord shall delight the heart, and shall give joy and gladness. Thus this very fear leads to the acquisition of a firm hope in God, which makes the soul happy: He that fears the Lord shall tremble at nothing, and shall not be afraid, for He is his hope. The soul of him that fears the Lord is blessed. Yes, blessed, because fear draws man away from sin. The fear of the Lord drives out sin and at the same time infuses into him a great desire of observing the commandments: Blessed is the man that fears the Lord: he shall delight exceedingly in His commandments.'

St. Alphonsus Maria de Liguori

'No one can love God consciously in his heart unless he has first feared Him with all his heart. Through the action of fear the soul is purified and, as it were, made malleable and so it becomes awakened to the action of love. No one, however, can come to fear God completely in the way described, unless he first transcends all worldly cares; for when the intellect reaches a state of deep stillness and detachment, then the fear of God begins to trouble it, purifying it with full perception from all gross and cloddish density, and thereby bringing it to a great love for God's goodness. . . Fear and love are found together only in the righteous who achieve virtue through the energy of the Holy Spirit in them. For this reason Holy Scripture says in one place: "O fear the Lord, all you who are His saints," (Ps. 34:9) and in another: "O love the Lord, all you who are His saints." (Ps. 31:23) From this we see clearly that the righteous, who are still in the process of being purified, are characterized both by fear and by a moderate measure of love; perfect love, on the other hand, is found only in those who have already been purified and in whom there is no longer any thought of fear, but rather a constant burning and binding of the soul to God through the energy of the Holy Spirit. As it is written, "My soul is bound to Thee: Thy right hand has upheld me." (Ps. 63:8. LXX)'

St. Diadochos of Photiki

[Shin]

'Holy Scripture tells us that whoever gives in to temptation will perish. Never fear temptation: it is useful and necessary to us. I must arm myself with prayer and have complete trust in Our Lord and great mistrust of myself. I must face every trial with profound humility and blind, simple, happy obedience.

Jesus crucified is my model. I must work tirelessly to be like him. I should not longer allow myself to be sad about anything other than offending him or having nothing to suffer for him, for love of him.'

St. Bernadette Soubirous

This quote, in the context of the above.. of course one must not misread it as having anything against the rules in regards to how we deal with temptation, that is, an obligatory avoidance of the near occasions of sins without which I have heard St. Alphonsus say we may be 'justly abandoned'.

[Shin]

that we might learn, come to fear, and correct our ways.

Learn to fear? But isn't learning to love the rather than fear our a most important lesson from the NT? After all, 'charity covers a multitude of sins'.

Asking the question: What is repentance, is it a thought, or is it in the will?

That is exactly what I was wondering. It must be both - since we are creatures that have both capacities. It seems to me that one without the other wouldn't be complete (although better than nothing, I suppose).

But there are bad kinds of fear too of course.

[Brigid]

St. Diadochos of Photiki seems to have almost directly answered the question. Fear leading to love.

I so like St. Bernadette!


What do you mean by the bad kinds of fear? How would you define the 'good' kind?

[Shin]

St. Diadochos of Photiki seems to have almost directly answered the question. Fear leading to love.

I so like St. Bernadette!


What do you mean by the bad kinds of fear? How would you define the 'good' kind?

You know I was thinking I should focus a bit more on the bad since it does harm.. but I actually don't have firm definitions in my head. . Just approaching it practically whether it actually produces good results or not to a degree.. or trying to.. in my own life certainly I've given into unproductive fear plenty of times..

I guess that what St. Francis de Sales as well as others have to say about anxiety and how useless and harmful it is would cover a good deal of 'bad fear'. Not that I entirely listen about that.

Got to go for a bit, going to take a walk while the weather is good, maybe go down to the gym room and use the machines.. God bless you Brigid i pray! 

[martin]

This story from the desert fathers, follows a theme I have seen often that is of begging God's mercy and for acceptance of repentance repeatedly.

What is sin but to deny our Baptismal vows?

What has been on my mind lately is the difference between brief or temporary repentance and lasting repentance. I shall include another story in a moment about that.

And also thinking of this in the context of what we had come up earlier, about how the will to do a sin had we the opportunity, can be the same in God's eyes as the sin.

So, I am thinking of how to lastingly repent of sins it seems to me we need to think ahead to ourselves faced what tempts us, and deny it as if in the moment of temptation and so strengthen ourselves when the actual temptation comes. Preparing ourselves ahead of time, and changing our hearts to reject sin naturally both when it is attempting to tempt us and when we are simply sorrowed over it and repentant.

Because I think for repeat sins, we are often repentant after sin, but when the temptation comes upon us again, we overeat, we get angry, we fail again in one situation or another.

In other words, we have made an outward resolution, because of our emotions in repentance but inwardly, we have failed to follow through and change ourselves so that it is truly no longer a part of our lives. So that when tempted again, it returns to us.

So we have to prepare ahead of time and change ourselves interiorly so that we are finally resistant to sin whatever our emotional state. By this test, we make our repentance for all sorts of sins more lasting and true.

We have to picture two kinds of person, the before and the after, and what that person is like inside.. and become the new man by empathizing with him, how he feels, how he thinks, how he acts, this is what we have to become, and the old one we need to no longer empathize with in such a way that we are that person. 

Well, just thinking aloud a bit here, for what little it is worth.

Shin you really got me thinking with what you said there. I have been thinking similar thoughts but can't quite put into words the understanding of it and I can't believe how I just happened to stumble across this little booklet lastnight which has answered so many questions on what we were discussing.

It was writen by Fr Faber and called, "Abiding sorrow for sin."  It's in PDF format so I couldn't cut and paste any of it but I've emailed you the link so you can read it for yourself and maybe sometime modify it for Saints Books.
It's short (about a 15 min read) but what it contains could be the answer to daily progress in sanctity. I think it''s a treasure. 

[Brigid]

In bygone days, only pure and spotless victims were acceptable to Almighty God; to satisfy Divine Justice, they must be perfect. But now the law of fear is superseded by the law of love, and love has chosen me as a victim, frail and imperfect as I am. It is surely a worthy choice for love to make, since to be wholly satisfied it must stoop down to nothingness and turn that nothingness to fire.
I know , my God, that "Love is repaid by love alone" (St. John of the Cross) and so I have sought and found a way to ease my heart by giving love for love.

St. Therese of Lisieux

Heavenly Father and Father of my Lord Jesus Christ,
I bless You because You have in your mercy
remembered so poor a creature as me.
O merciful Father, the God who gives all encouragement,
I bring You my thanks
because You send Your comfort to encourage me
when I deserve no comfort at all.
O Father with the only-begotten Son
and the Holy Spirit the Comforter,
I bless you always and give You the glory for ever.
Dear Lord and God! O Holy One, O Lover of my soul!
when You come to my heart,
all that is within me will leap up for joy.

The Imitation of Christ

It is, then, about my weaknesses
that I am happiest of all to boast,
so that the power of Christ may rest upon me;
and that is why I am glad of weakness,
insults, constraints, persecutions and distress
for Christ's sake.
For it is when I am weak that I am strong.

2 Cor 12:9-10

Whoever believes that Jesus is the Christ
is a child of God,
and whoever loves the father
loves the son.
In this way we know that we love God's children,
when we love God and keep his commandments.
This is what the love of God is:
keeping his commandments.
Nor are his commandments burdensome,
because every child of God
overcomes the world.
And this is the victory that has overcome the world--
our faith.

1 John 5:1-4

[Shin]

"Boasting in weakness.."

Definitely always makes a person think!

[Shin]

Shin you really got me thinking with what you said there. I have been thinking similar thoughts but can't quite put into words the understanding of it and I can't believe how I just happened to stumble across this little booklet lastnight which has answered so many questions on what we were discussing.

It was writen by Fr Faber and called, "Abiding sorrow for sin."  It's in PDF format so I couldn't cut and paste any of it but I've emailed you the link so you can read it for yourself and maybe sometime modify it for Saints Books.
It's short (about a 15 min read) but what it contains could be the answer to daily progress in sanctity. I think it''s a treasure. 

Thank you Martin, I am reading it now and benefiting from it. Some of what Brigid just quoted is helping with it too.