Fundamentals of Catholic Dogma: Lesson #1: Knowledge of God

[Shin]

Excerpts from Ludwig Ott's 'Fundamentals of Catholic Dogma'

God, our Creator and Lord, can be known with certainty, by the natural light of reason from created things. (De fide.)

The Vatican Council defined: "If anybody says that the one true God, Our Creator and Lord cannot be known with certainty in the light of human reason by those things which have been made, anathema sit."

Acccording to the testimony of Holy Writ, the existence of God can be known:

a) from nature: "For by the greatness of the beauty and of the creature, the creator of them may be seen." Wis. 13, 1-9, v. 5

"For the invisible things of Him from the creation of the world are clearly seen, being understood by the things that are made. His eternal power and His divinity also: so that they are inexcusable. " Rom 1,20

The knowledge of God witnessed to in these two passages is a natural, certain, immediate, and easily achieved knowledge.

b) from conscience: For when the Gentiles, who know not the (Mosaic) law do by nature these things that are of the law; these, having not the law, are a law to themselves. Who shew the work of the law written in their hearts." The heathens (that is) know naturally, without supernatural revelation, the essential contents of the Old Testament law. In their hearts a law has been written whose binding power indicates a Supreme Lawgiver.

c) from history: Acts 14,14-16; 17, 26-29 St. Paul, in his discourses at Lystra and at the Areopagus in Athens shows that God reveals Himself in beneficent works also to the heathens, and that it is easy to find Him, as he is near to each of us: "For in Him we live, and more and are".

[Shin]

A.. B.. C...

I am thinking Fundamentals may be one of those top books to take to the desert island when stranded.. that is besides 'DIY Boatmaking."

[Brigid]

A.. B.. C...

I am thinking Fundamentals may be one of those top books to take to the desert island when stranded.. that is besides 'DIY Boatmaking."

It's a really good book for that (unless you are so overwhelmed by it that you don't want to read it at all, of course). When I read it (parts), I was overwhelmed not by the content but by the size of it with theology that needed to be thought about so. I've read other books that size with no problem, but that one was so "meaty".

[martin]

The fool says in his heart, "There is no God." (Psalm 14: 1)

I remember at 5 yrs old learning off by heart the foundamentals of the faith in a question and answer format.
Question;  Why did God make me?
Answer;  To know, love and serve Him in this world, and to be happy with Him for ever in heaven.

The whole faith in one line.  Getting back to basics can be a worthwhile exercise.

[Shin]

I've gone through a good deal of it just going to different portions to look things up, but it has so much in it that is so useful I wish I had the discipline to read it straight through.

[Shin]

The fool says in his heart, "There is no God." (Psalm 14: 1)

I remember at 5 yrs old learning off by heart the foundamentals of the faith in a question and answer format.
Question;  Why did God make me?
Answer;  To know, love and serve Him in this world, and to be happy with Him for ever in heaven.

The whole faith in one line.  Getting back to basics can be a worthwhile exercise.

I had that quote in my mind reading this too!

The world is so beautiful.. there has to be God..

[Brigid]

The fool says in his heart, "There is no God." (Psalm 14: 1)

I remember at 5 yrs old learning off by heart the foundamentals of the faith in a question and answer format.
Question;  Why did God make me?
Answer;  To know, love and serve Him in this world, and to be happy with Him for ever in heaven.

The whole faith in one line.  Getting back to basics can be a worthwhile exercise.

I had that quote in my mind reading this too!

The world is so beautiful.. there has to be God..

The intricacy of flowers and bees and bugs and ....... how could all of that be accidental? That doesn't make any sense!

[Shin]

I remember as a small child I had a bug barn of some kind, where I kept a caterpillar and a leaf from a milkweed plant... watched it become a monarch butterfly.. found it all in the field next to my grandmother's house (on my father's side).

You look at the ants, marching along and have fun with that.. the bees.. which reminds me I still haven't explored their spiritual meaning enough.. all the bees serving their Queen.. gathering pollen and bringing forth honey..

I should open up St. Isidore's Etymologies again.. it has a good deal of this sort of understanding. I was just thinking about it today, but only read through a book collecting various medieval handbooks of standard penances for various sins, the 'Penitentials', in my ongoing project to try to gather together some standard ideas of penances overall and discover various sins we might not think about today, but which still apply, and so on. . . .

Not quite so pleasant reading that however, because they repeat sin after sin, which one would just as soon not call to mind at all.

The volume I have which collects the penitentials is full of additionally, all sorts of erroneous commentary. Which whenever I see it, I remember gratefully the God given habit of going to the sources I recommend to everyone.

[Brigid]

the bees.. which reminds me I still haven't explored their spiritual meaning enough.. all the bees serving their Queen.. gathering pollen and bringing forth honey..

I've never considered that.............!

[Shin]

You know I hesitate even to say it's symbolic, because in a real sense God knows how all Creation will be a sign towards us in one way or another, or represent His goodness.

So while symbolic.. but really too.. really representative.. made for that purpose..

In tumult, yet also giving glory..

Here for example is St. Isidore on the meaning and history of the word 'ocean'

"The Greeks and Latins name the ocean, oceanus, because like a circle, circulus, it goes around the whole earth, orbis. [Or, from quickness,  because it runs very fast, ocius currit.] Likewise, as the sky, it shines with a purple colour: oceanus is as if [greek] dark purple. It surrounds the coasts of the lands, approaching and receding with alternating tides."

Huh! There's purple too!

Hmm, let's see, perhaps St. Francis de Sales will be more revealing on bees:

'Even so venial sins which pass over a devout soul without being harboured, do not permanently injure it, but if such sins are fostered and cherished, they destroy the sweet savour of that soul that is to say, its devotion. The spider cannot kill bees, but it can spoil their honey, and so encumber their combs with its webs in course of time, as to hinder the bees materially. Just so, though venial sins may not lose the soul, they will spoil its devotion, and so cumber its faculties with bad habits and evil inclinations, as to deprive it of all that cheerful readiness which is the very essence of true devotion; that is to say, if they are harboured in the conscience by delight taken therein.'

'Those impure words which are spoken in disguise, and with an affectation of reserve, are the most harmful of all; for just as the sharper the point of a dart, so much deeper it will pierce the flesh, so the sharper an unholy word, the more it penetrates the heart. And as for those who think to show themselves knowing when they say such things, they do not even understand the first object of mutual intercourse among men, who ought rather to be like a hive of bees gathering to make honey by good and useful conversation, than like a wasps' nest, feeding on corruption. If any impertinent person addresses you in unseemly language, show that you are displeased by turning away, or by whatever other method your discretion may indicate.'

'When the young bees first begin to live they are mere grubs, unable to hover over flowers, or to fly to the mountains, or even to the little hills where they might gather honey; but they are fed for a time with the honey laid up by their predecessors, and by degrees the grubs put forth their wings and grow strong, until they fly abroad and gather their harvest from all the country round. Now we are yet but as grubs in devotion, unable to fly at will, and attain the desired aim of Christian perfection; but if we begin to take shape through our desires and resolutions, our wings will gradually grow, and we may hope one day to become spiritual bees, able to fly. Meanwhile let us feed upon the honey left us in the teaching of so many holy men of old, praying God that He would grant us doves' wings, so that we may not only fly during this life, but find an abiding resting-place in Eternity.'

Ah, I thought he'd be more useful. I remember his 'Mystical Flora' or 'The Christian Life Under the Emblem of Plants', which is a compilation of his writings fitting the topic.

On the physical sciences the saints can often just repeat the science of the day with all its flaws, but their spiritual use of it all is an example and model for us all..  

[Brigid]

Does any Saint speak of ants/bees/etc. and their devotion to their queen?

[Shin]

Does any Saint speak of ants/bees/etc. and their devotion to their queen?

I feel like I have read it somewhere but I do not know where.

'In meditating, make use of some pious book, at least in the beginning, and lay it aside when you come to any part which particularly strikes you. St. Francis of Sales says, that, in this, you must imitate bees, which settle upon flowers so long as they find honey in them, and then pass on to others. The fruits to be derived from meditation are three: affections, prayers, and resolutions; in the exercise of these consist the great advantage of mental prayer.   

St. Alphonsus Maria de Liguori

Which makes me think one of these days I should mail to you moderators at least, some DVD or other archives of my saints' and religious book library, which I over time try to add to Saints' Books.

It's a good practice the above.. and I commend it especially to the moderators as ways of starting threads and engaging in discussions, but also to all. It is the method for the Saints' Discussion Forums.

Read something from a saints' book, and if it strikes you and inspires you, share it with others so they too will profit from its beauty and help.

[martin]

I feel like I have read it somewhere but I do not know where.

Me too... I've read many times concerning Ants, bees and even wasps from the saints writings but can't right now thing of which saint said what.
I've read about ants being a lesson in how so many individuals acting together as if they were really only one body are a sign from nature as to the unity of the Church.
This I was discussing with a priest and two friends yesterday (without reference to ants which only now has given me confirmation of what we discussed).
We talked about the importance of unity among believers and conformity and assent to the Churches infallible teachings and dogmas. It was a very strained discussion which lasted about 3 hrs. My work colleague and I were on one side of the discussion and our other friend and Fr on the other side.
It was terribly distressing to find that there were not only small differences of opinion but that we were absolutely poles apart on this issue.. To be continued though..

I think it was St Vincent Ferrer in one of his sermons used the analogy of wasps who signified the evil one and bees who signified the faithful on how they can even draw from the thorniest bushes and bitterest of flowers so much sweet honey. In fact recently I heard a sermon on Audio Sancto where the priest used this analogy.

So many lessons to be learnt from nature concerning the spiritual life. He never stops speaking to us through His creation 

  

[Shin]

I'm sorry to hear about the distressing conversation with the priest.. I've had more than one of this kind myself.. I've tried different approaches.. sigh.

[Bailey2]

My work colleague and I were on one side of the discussion and our other friend and Fr on the other side.

OK, now this sounds like good sparring material!      


Incidentally, Albert Einstein and Stephen Hawkings both believe there is a God through their study of the universe.......

[martin]

OK, now this sounds like good sparring material!

   

I think on this occassion Baily you would have been on my side.  

The final question I felt I had to ask was, "Father what must I do to get to hell? If you can tell me then I'll know what I must do to avoid it."
The reply, "I don't know."

Incidentally, Albert Einstein and Stephen Hawkings both believe there is a God through their study of the universe.......

I've heard recently that Stephen Hawking has changed his view on this. I must check it out